Course Upkeep

Cherokee County - Canton, GA

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Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Tue May 27, 2008 11:54 am

In Prep for the Jr. Tourney Saturday, we have been tightening up a few things.

Props to:

Shoe Scheuer for always walking the course with a grocery bag and picking up trash!

Richard and Martha Johnston for helping to clear the schule on 10, the "snake pit" on 11, the bases of 11's trees going up the fairway, and working on the tee pads.

Brandon for dropping his bag and picking up the loppers to help clear the schule around 11's trees last weekend.

Wade Selph for showing up on Saturday and helping me clean up hole 4 and then pushing me to do 16's fairway..... Which by the way, came out awesome thanks to Wades tireless efforts (Wade for hire, coming to a course near you)!

Steve Nelson & Steve Smith for helping with emptying all the garbage cans throughout the course on Sunday.

The course is looking good right now with only a few more holes left to work on. Most ALL tree/brush trimming has been completed and fairways have been made ready for the weedeater.

1. Done
2. Done
3. Done
4. Done
5. Done
6. Weedeat/clear schule left side from basket A to basket B.
7. Done
8. Done
9. Done
10. Done
11. Done
12. Done
13. Done
14. Done
15. Done
16. Done
17. Done
18. Weedeat in front of tee pad.

I will be at the course today after work (unless I take a half day today) Tues, Thur, and Friday. Call/look me up at the course if you decide you would like to help.

We have new signs/directional’s being made, but we will try to get the signs/directional’s out on 12, 13, and 17 to avoid any confusion.
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Re: Spring Cleaning

Postby JPZ » Tue May 27, 2008 11:59 am

Jay wrote:Wade Selph for showing up on Saturday and helping me clean up hole 4 and then pushing me to do 16's fairway..... Which by the way, came out awesome thanks to Wades tireless efforts (Wade for hire, coming to a course near you)!


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Postby Jay » Wed May 28, 2008 11:43 am

Thursday & Friday after work I will be at Sequoyah Park trying to finish the grounds maintenance.

Finished hole 3 yesterday!

If your interested in helping, please bring a weedeater. I have extra clippers but there is only a little clipping left on 1 or 2 holes.

So, for all those guys that have asked me to let them know the next time I do any clearing.........come on out and rock-n-roll.
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Postby Jay » Fri May 30, 2008 10:40 am

If you want to help finish cleaning up the course (TL), I will be out there after work again today (TL). So if you have a weedeater (TL) or would like to donate some time (TL), come on out (TL) as I sure could use the help :)

Can you make it today Matt?
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Postby Jay » Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:29 am

Great big Thanks to Steve Nelson for helping me out Friday afternoon and Saturday morning to get the course ready for the Jrs. Tourney!

Hopefully we can get a video or pictures to post up once it stops raining.

I could see it now, we post a video with the course looking sweet. Someone new to the games checks it out ans says "Lets go play Sequoyah Park" and when they get there to play a round the schule has come back all gnarly with vengence!

Anyway, get on out while the course is in excellent shape, should last a couple of months!
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Postby Funky Bobby J » Mon Jun 02, 2008 8:20 am

Thanks for the work you guys have put in. I have not been out for a while and the course looked great Saturday. I will definitely be taking the Johnson crew to Sequoyah more often now this summer as they are really getting pumped after Rand's tournament.

It's time for a sanctioned tournament there now!!!
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Postby keith johnson » Mon Jun 02, 2008 10:48 am

Funky Bobby J wrote:It's time for a sanctioned tournament there now!!!


Just had 1 there Bob, Geez! :lol:
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Postby Jay » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:20 pm

Funky Bobby J wrote:Thanks for the work you guys have put in. I have not been out for a while and the course looked great Saturday. I will definitely be taking the Johnson crew to Sequoyah more often now this summer as they are really getting pumped after Rand's tournament.

It's time for a sanctioned tournament there now!!!


Thanks for the kudos to the Sequoyah Snakessssss. The course is a groundskeepers paradise (which means they are gainfully employed).

Let’s not forget the first ever PDGA C-Tier Sanctioned SWO5 Tourney:
http://www.discgolfatlanta.com/images/SWO2005-Open.jpg

......Now that some kickin' bling!
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Postby richardhead » Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:51 pm

That was my first tournament. I had the win in sight until whakow, first hole second round Crickey aces 14. Devastating. :cry:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:31 am

Theirs a new snake in town!

Great big thanks to Steve Nelson (The Animal screen name) for his latest donation this past Friday:

1. Steve mowed the following holes 3, 6, 8, 9, 10 & 11.
2. Cleaned up the large branches that fell down next to 6B and in front of hole 10’s approach area.
3. Removed the nasty schule that grew back on the extreme left of 10 & 11.

Also – Thanks to all players that pick up sticks off the fairway and putting areas and throwing them in the woods!

Those that play this course know it is hard to maintain during the spring/summer so all help is much appreciated. The parks usually just cut parts of 2/10/11 and all of 18.......

Thanks!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:36 am

On Saturday Steve Nelson and I cleared the left side of 13 (down the walking trail for the lefty / sidearm drive).

On Tuesday Mr. Nelson cleared the schule around the swimming pool (pond) at 14 and cleared the creek bed in front of 14’s basket. Big props to Steve for his tireless efforts on helping out and keeping the course clear.

Also the snakes have order 6 new anchors. Projected placements that I know of:
1. Hole 10 replace original short pin position.
2. Hole 18 replace original left placement (by park entrance).
3. Hole 18 possible middle position (behind entrance marquee) between new trees.

The other 3 anchors are still being discussed where they may go.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Oct 02, 2008 10:46 am

Garbage cans are empy now.

Holes 2, 3, 10 Tee area, and 11's hill to long basket have been weedeated.

Next up finish 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:48 am

Big props to Steve N. (a.k.a. The Animal) for his continued hard labor on getting the course ready for the fall.

Holes 13 & 14 have been mowed, weedeated, and de-schuled.....OMG, it looks so awesome!

Hole 17: Also the long grass around the top of the hill where the basket is has been trimmed down

Next up:

15 - Clear the drive path
16 - Drop a tree
17 - Drop 2 trees
18 - Clear in front of Tee pad

Once all this is completed, we will be good until next spring!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:55 am

Jay wrote:
The other 3 anchors are still being discussed where they may go.


Jay are you accepting suggestions?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:27 am

Big Red, how are you these days?

Suggestions are always a way to find out what y'all are thinking. Getting it by the course designers will be the key.

What are you thinking about? We have many ideas so bring something new and I will make sure it gets passed on.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:47 pm

I'm doing well Jay thanks for asking! Well, for me the biggest thing that would make the course better is to make it longer. I have thought about this and it would be kind of challenging but I have a few ideas. Couldn't hole nine be lengthened in the traditional position by maybe tunneling back into the woods further towards two's basket? If that hole could be made fourty or fifty feet longer I think it would make for a much more diffcult shot especially given the angle. Also how far does the park land go to the left of hole five? I ask this because it seems like hole four could be made much longer going in both directions by utilizing that area. Imagine a pin position a hundred feet further in the woods or a tee pad for the other direction. That would make for an interesting shot as opposed to what kind of feels like a connecting hole sometimes. I was also wondering if maybe an alternate tee pad on seven could be made further back possibly to the point where it becomes a blind shot. That would make this hole much more interesting. Lastly I was wondering if anyone has ever considered a straightened position for hole eight. What I mean by this is keeping the left to right orintation but make the angle less steep by lenghting it using the triangle of woods between the current basket position and four's fairway and nine's tee pad. I think if some of these positions were made the entire course would take on a different feel even though it would be adding only maybe 250 feet to the course. I would also be interested in helping out if anyone likes any of these ideas.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:26 pm

Big Red: I have thought about this and it would be kind of challenging but I have a few ideas. Couldn't hole nine be lengthened in the traditional position by maybe tunneling back into the woods further towards two's basket?

Jay: This is already in the planning phase. I was asked to place a stake in the spot recommended.

Big Red: Also how far does the park land go to the left of hole five? I ask this because it seems like hole four could be made much longer going in both directions by utilizing that area. Imagine a pin position a hundred feet further in the woods or a tee pad for the other direction.

Jay: Nice thought but, holes 2, 3, 4, 5, and behind 6's tee pad are all bordering the property line :(

Big Red: I was also wondering if maybe an alternate tee pad on seven could be made further back possibly to the point where it becomes a blind shot. That would make this hole much more interesting.

Jay: Yes, we have talked about this. It's a really wicked, up hill, blind shot that would just make it so much harder :) After cleaning up holes 15-18, this would be a nice project to do. We have the matts to make alternate tees, just need some labor.

Big Red: Lastly I was wondering if anyone has ever considered a straightened position for hole eight. What I mean by this is keeping the left to right orintation but make the angle less steep by lenghting it using the triangle of woods between the current basket position and four's fairway and nine's tee pad.

Jay: We have looked at 3 diferent positions on this hole and your recommendation is one of them. Hole 8 is very technical short hole. The added distance in your recommendation has to be minimal becuase of the tees on 4, 9, and 10's basket. Lets see what Don & Richard have to say :)

Big Red: I would also be interested in helping out if anyone likes any of these ideas.

Jay: Oh, so you are only interested in helping out if your idea is incorporated?? lol :lol: :lol:

Thanks for the input Big Red, watch for new positions and the Sequoyah Park thread for when we have updates & WORK DAYS. Keep the ideas rolling.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:42 pm

Jay wrote:
Big Red: I would also be interested in helping out if anyone likes any of these ideas.

Jay: Oh, so you are only interested in helping out if your idea is incorporated?? lol :lol: :lol:



Better than nothing, right? :lol:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby mr.disc » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:48 pm

move all baskets to a right side position ? :lol:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:50 pm

Big Red wrote:
Jay wrote:
Big Red: I would also be interested in helping out if anyone likes any of these ideas.

Jay: Oh, so you are only interested in helping out if your idea is incorporated?? lol :lol: :lol:



Better than nothing, right? :lol:


True!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:56 pm

Longer holes:

#1 - tee off from the gravel by the first base dugout.
#2 - after completing hole 1 turn left down the walking trail and tee off where it levels out for hole number 2.
#9 - Tee off from 8's tee and play to 9.
#10 - Tee off and play to 8's basket.
#12 - Tee off further down the walking trail or over from the playground.
#13 - Tee off by the concession stand.
#14 - Tee off from the parking lot behind the tee. Go as far as you can handle.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:07 pm

Not too invalid at all, but they do make good Safari holes.......we do it all the time! Changes things up.

It's a Nubby design :)
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:51 pm

Good ideas. I never thought about the safari option.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Wed Oct 08, 2008 4:00 pm

Jay, what other Cherokee county parks have you tried to get a course put in at?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Oct 20, 2008 10:44 am

J.J. Biello off of Hwy 5 in Woodstock and land that has been donated to the parks up in Ball Ground on hwy 372 & Creighton Rd.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Oct 20, 2008 10:54 am

Hole 15 has been cleared for take off! The walking trail has been de-schuled and the right side (hill by scoccer field) has been cleared! Big thanks to Steve Nelson and Al Sandidge for their help!!!!

WARNING: As you walk up 15 and pass the pond, on the right where the clearing starts on the hill, there is a steroid induced yellow jacket hive that made me pay the price for clearing.......be carful by the first pine tree on cleared hill.

I will post when we kill the nest.....The nest has been VERMINATED!!!!!!!!!

Course is looking good!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Oct 23, 2008 11:10 am

Yesterday we removed 3 trees and cleared the fairway on hole 16 AND started clearing for a longer 16 :)

Hole 17 we cleared the island that you tee through by cropping 2 small hardwoods and a pine.

New: We are in work on placing a longer anchor in on #9. Basically drive down the right side and hyzer past the current 9A position another 40 feet :)
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Re: Course Upkeep 3-10 Nov

Postby Jay » Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:56 pm

Busy, Busy, Busy at the Sac!

1. We added a new 1 right, cleared area and anchor installed.
2. We add a new 6 (sic) xtra long, cleared area and staked.
3. We add a new right 9 xtra long, cleared and anchored.
4. We hooked up 16’s tee pad with a custom designed retaining wall complete with steps, all made of 4x4’s. It is soooo freaking sweet now!
5. Started clearing a new fairway on hole 2 for an alternate tee. Alt tee located in the woods to the left of current tee pad.

1A 180’
1B 215’

6A 237’
6B 278
6C 350’

9A 210’
9B TBA
9C 245ish – needs true measurement

Big Thanks to the below individuals for contributing their man-hours to the course:
Al Sandidge
The Animal
Chappy - Yes CHAPPY! Can you believe it :)
SS
Richard

Saturday more anchors will be going in. Which ones.... not sure yet:
New 6C
New (old) Short 10A 293' which was destroyed by a fallen tree.
Old 18: By the stop sign.
New 18: Behind the Park Entrance Sign between the trees.

I'll be at the park at 10am if your interested in helping out.

peace
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:48 am

Saturday anchors Installed:
New 6C
New (old) Short 10A

Staked 2 new positions on 18 and we should have these cemented in this weekend.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Fri Nov 21, 2008 9:41 am

For those that said they would like to help out with course maintenance, this Saturday 22 Nov, I will be out at the course at 10:00am..........

Any time you can contribute will be appreciated. Would love to get two benches installed.

Action afterwards.......
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Funky Bobby J » Mon Dec 01, 2008 9:21 am

Course is looking great - I got out and played a little on Friday and was really inpressed. Good job - cannot wait for Sunday.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby thedude » Tue Mar 10, 2009 4:09 pm

It seems the sign for hole 6 is not there, and with this being a hole with two blind basket placements the clothes pin system could be really helpful here.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby bogeymaster » Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:34 am

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Re: Course Upkeep - Garbage Cans

Postby Jay » Mon May 11, 2009 11:42 am

Yesterday, the garbage can bags for holes 5, 6, 9, 10, and 11 were changed and hauled up to tee 11 and placed by the garbage can (except for hole 5, which still needs to be taken out).

If you are playing today or tomorrow and would like to help out, please take a bag or two and move it to the play ground or parking garbage cans.

Thanks!
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Re: Course Upkeep - Garbage Cans

Postby Jay » Mon May 18, 2009 10:38 am

Jay wrote:Yesterday, the garbage can bags for holes 5, 6, 9, 10, and 11 were changed and hauled up to tee 11 and placed by the garbage can (except for hole 5, which still needs to be taken out).

If you are playing today or tomorrow and would like to help out, please take a bag or two and move it to the play ground or parking garbage cans.

Thanks!


Thanks to the player(s) that hauled the garbage bags out!!!! Much appreciated.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby SequoyahSnake » Wed May 27, 2009 10:52 am

I can help out.....
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:39 am

bogeymaster wrote:next time you guys are out doing clean up on the course let me know i would love to help.


Just grab a weedeater and walk through the fairways anytime! 13, 14, 15, 16 is a great place to start :)

Hoping to get out there soon to de-branch a few areas: 3, 13 down walking trail, 14 off the tee, 15 left and right side of walking trail.

We also hope to get new tee signs with hole placements and description.

Thanks to those that are helping with the course maintenance!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Jun 11, 2009 11:49 am

Jay wrote:17 Nov 2009: Saturday anchors Installed:
New 6C - 350'


We have added a longer 4th pin position to hole number 6. The anchor for 6D was installed yesterday by Steve "The Animal" Nelson (Thanks). We don't have the total length yet but it might be around 450.

If you are standing at 6C's basket with your back to the tee pad, look over the basket at about 11:00........ Sould be in this position next Wednesday.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby bogeymaster » Thu Jun 11, 2009 2:35 pm

.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Jun 11, 2009 3:09 pm

yes....

* the grass in front of 13's tee pad and around the landing/basket area.
* around the pond on 14 and in the drainage ditch leading up to 14's landing area, and all the putting area around the basket.
* around the bowl/landing area for 15 and also the right side hill leading up to the soccer field.
* 16's fairway and landing area.
* at the top ridge line where the straw grass grows all the way around.

Steve and I did holes 1, 2, 10's tee area and all of 11 so they are good.

After the back gets done 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 12 fairways can get cleared with a weedeater too.

Thanks for the help, it is very much appreciated!
Jay

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Re: New Hole 6D

Postby Jay » Wed Jun 17, 2009 2:55 pm

Here are the distances for hole 6 to include the new 6D placement:

6a: 237'
6b: 277'
6c: 350'
6d: 432'
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby mikfish711 » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:28 am

is 6D still a par 3?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:32 am

Why would it be a par 4? You can reach the basket with two good shots. It's only 437 feet.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:57 am

mikfish711 wrote:is 6D still a par 3?


yes
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:12 am

CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:Why would it be a par 4? You can reach the basket with two good shots. It's only 437 feet.


Because that means you can't make a birdie on it. It should be a par 4.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Shoe » Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:33 am

Because that means you can't make a birdie on it. It should be a par 4.


Your negative outlook on the situation will not be of any help. :roll: If your aim is true then it is most defiantly a birdieable hole.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:43 am

Big Red wrote:
CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:Why would it be a par 4? You can reach the basket with two good shots. It's only 437 feet.


Because that means you can't make a birdie on it. It should be a par 4.



Yes, you can. Ask Phil Arthur. Most people can't. There are plenty of par 4's in ball golf that am's cannot birdie. That doesn't make it a par 5.

PAR= professional average return/result (can't remember which one)

If you want to tell me that most pro's would be walking out with a 4, go ahead......
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Tue Jul 07, 2009 11:22 am

I am not sure if Richard or Don have made the decision just yet to call it a par 3 or 4. We just like playing it :)

I would think for the Pros it would be a par 3 and maybe not so much for ams as it's like a "tweener" kind of.

I know that I would never set 6D up in a tourney due to 10/11 fairways, but for now it is a killer hole. I love that hole 5 and 6 are back to back. This really makes you work towards getting your par on these holes, which when you do, you will pick up strokes on a majority of your field.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Tue Jul 07, 2009 11:46 am

CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:
Big Red wrote:
CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:Why would it be a par 4? You can reach the basket with two good shots. It's only 437 feet.


Because that means you can't make a birdie on it. It should be a par 4.



Yes, you can. Ask Phil Arthur. Most people can't. There are plenty of par 4's in ball golf that am's cannot birdie. That doesn't make it a par 5.

PAR= professional average return/result (can't remember which one)

If you want to tell me that most pro's would be walking out with a 4, go ahead......


If you want to tell me that a good percentage of pro's would be walking out with a 2, go ahead..... When virtually everyone that plays the hole makes the same number you have a problem and I think this position is that. I just don't see this position creating much of a scoring spread. It is interesting and more length is always welcomed at sequoyah but this isn't a world class hole. The majority of players will make either a three or a four depending on luck and very, very few 2's also depending on luck. The problem is not the length but the fact that the trees and the angle make it kind of an odd shot over the hill. You can throw a good shot and get screwed very easily. I just hate the idea, that disc golfers seem to love, of holes that are only birdied once every six months; and of course I am referring to pro players. This rarely happens in golf except in extreme situations or at the open championship or the US Open and even then the USGA or the R&A realize the problem and take steps to fix it. Examples of this are numerous. I'm sure you remember the 101st US Open at Southern Hills where the 18th green was watered and not mowed between rounds to make the hole fair and play at the appropriate par. On many par 5's someone at some point has made a double eagle. Should that now be a par three because someone one time made a two?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:04 pm

If I thought that a good percentage of pro's would walk out with a 2, I would be arguing that the hole was a par 2, due to the definition of par. Virtually everyone that plays the hole takes the same amount of shots? That's news to me.

I'll agree with you that I think some trees should be taken out. But, if you walk to the right of the short pin position, you will see a very big hole that would be great to approach from. Luck has nothing to do with getting there. I've seen people throw over the hill and out in the fairway numerous times. I think luck might play a small role (again, I think a couple of trees should be removed), but skill is still the deciding factor. I'm not a fan of chuck and pray holes either, which I why I rarely play ERP. But, there is a defined line that you can take to get out in the fairway, if you can throw it that far.

As for throwing a good shot and getting screwed.....

Risk/Reward. You're an intelligent guy, I don't need to explain that to you.

As for ball golf.....

How many -8's do you see at Augusta National or any of the US Opens? What's wrong with par being a very good score on a hole? What's wrong with having a hole that is extremely difficult to birdie?

Lastly, does any of this make a difference? Does anyone write "par" or "birdie" on their scorecard?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:17 pm

BTW, how often do you birdie 18?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Tue Jul 07, 2009 12:30 pm

FYI - We are still tweaking the hole every time we play it. We continue to remove/trim at a slow pace because you can always take it down, but can't replace what is removed.

It may not be a world class hole to y'all but to the ones that have been working on the course, it's a classic hole to us!!!!!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Tue Jul 07, 2009 1:23 pm

Jay wrote:FYI - We are still tweaking the hole every time we play it. We continue to remove/trim at a slow pace because you can always take it down, but can't replace what is removed.

It may not be a world class hole to y'all but to the ones that have been working on the course, it's a classic hole to us!!!!!


I don't think you took it this way but just to be sure none of my comments, and I'm sure Cornelious' as well, are meant to be critical of you or anyone else that works on the course. Like I said the hole is interesting but it isn't world class. To put this comment in perspective I think there are only a handful of "world class" holes in the state. I actually would label six one the better holes if not the best at sequoyah as far as challenge and shot making.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Tue Jul 07, 2009 1:39 pm

CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:If I thought that a good percentage of pro's would walk out with a 2, I would be arguing that the hole was a par 2, due to the definition of par. Virtually everyone that plays the hole takes the same amount of shots? That's news to me.

I'll agree with you that I think some trees should be taken out. But, if you walk to the right of the short pin position, you will see a very big hole that would be great to approach from. Luck has nothing to do with getting there. I've seen people throw over the hill and out in the fairway numerous times. I think luck might play a small role (again, I think a couple of trees should be removed), but skill is still the deciding factor. I'm not a fan of chuck and pray holes either, which I why I rarely play ERP. But, there is a defined line that you can take to get out in the fairway, if you can throw it that far.

As for throwing a good shot and getting screwed.....

Risk/Reward. You're an intelligent guy, I don't need to explain that to you.

As for ball golf.....

How many -8's do you see at Augusta National or any of the US Opens? What's wrong with par being a very good score on a hole? What's wrong with having a hole that is extremely difficult to birdie?

Lastly, does any of this make a difference? Does anyone write "par" or "birdie" on their scorecard?


Clearly you missed most of my point. I am saying there aren't enough 2's made on the hole for it to be considered a par 3. It's really that simple. Luck does have something to do with getting there because you can throw a good shot and get screwed. What I mean by this is a 90% perfect shot should not put you out of position for the "big hole" that you are referring to. I have no idea how you are equating risk/reward to any of this. I think this may be most butchered and misunderstood term in disc golf. Nothing about this hole has anything to do with that concept. There was actually very low scoring at Augusta this year and Tiger made for some pretty low scoring at the 2000 US open. There have been others as well. There is nothing wrong with par being a good number but holes that severely limit birdie possibilities are bad holes or have the wrong par designation. Lastly you are right technically none of this does matter except psychologically; however, as a result of this factor I think the outcome of virtually every golf tournament ever played would be different if the pars were different. Climo and I had a conversation about this and he agreed. As for 18 I don't know that I have made a two on it in its current position. I know I have hit the basket from 40 or 50 feet but I don't think I have made it. I also think it is in the running for the worst hole on the course because it is too long for most to make a 2 on but even rec players can make a 3 on it regularly. It actually exemplifies a lot of what I am talking about.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Funky Bobby J » Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:41 pm

Risk/reward is when the pin is on the hill (like usual) are you going to go for the putt knowing that you could easily roll away or float past or lay it up for the 3? I agree with BR that few understand risk/reward. There is no real risk/reward in the long position. I think that it is an interesting hole long, but certainly not world class. It is defintely a par 3. The average score might be 3.5 for AMs, but it is a par 3 - most pros would par it, but few would deuce it.

I also agree that 18 is a weak hole, 17 is too, and 16 is a good hole but such a pain in the ass to negotiate. I have wondered if the woods b/w the parking lot and hole 14 could be utilized to change the course and make it flow better (essentially eliminating 15 - 18 eventhough 15 is a really good hole). So much work has been done, and I think that the land has been used pretty well, but I think many players out there just play the front 12 or 14 for a reason. I enjoy playing out there; I just wonder with some tweaking if it would not get more traffic and more tournament consideration.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:45 pm

How is it not risk/reward? If you play it safe, by laying up on the right side of the hill, you will have an easy approach shot. If you go for it, you risk missing the small gap, over the hill, which might leave you in a terrible position.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:46 pm

And Bobby, it's funny you mention that area by 14, because they are probably going to use it very soon. I like 16 and 17, but I wouldn't cry if they were done away with, in order to make the course flow better on the back six.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby bogeymaster » Tue Jul 07, 2009 5:18 pm

.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby thedude » Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:31 pm

just wait another 20 tears and 18 will be a tunnel shot thanks to the cherokee co. arbor society. :x :| :)
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Funky Bobby J » Tue Jul 07, 2009 9:46 pm

CorneliousVanderbildt wrote:And Bobby, it's funny you mention that area by 14, because they are probably going to use it very soon. I like 16 and 17, but I wouldn't cry if they were done away with, in order to make the course flow better on the back six.


Cool - I'd just like to see it in the tournament mix after all the work you guys have done, but the flow of the course is not very tournament-friendly. I think that it would be cool to do a super-class event with the 1st 12 holes.

Risk/reward is - "do I take a chance at going for something based upon the possible outcomes." No matter where my drive is on the hole, I am still going to try to put it close to the basket. You are right that position is important, but that is not really "risk/reward" just reward for easier approach for good placement.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby mikfish711 » Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:24 pm

Man, I did not mean to start this kind of ruckus. I just wanted to know how to play it.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:57 pm

mikfish711 wrote:Man, I did not mean to start this kind of ruckus. I just wanted to know how to play it.


lol......

I was wondering when you were going to log back on and find that your simple question didn't have a simple answer.

Anyway - play it as a 3 and BigRed can play it as a 4 :) :mrgreen:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Wed Jul 08, 2009 6:17 pm

Funky Bobby J wrote:Risk/reward is - "do I take a chance at going for something based upon the possible outcomes." No matter where my drive is on the hole, I am still going to try to put it close to the basket. You are right that position is important, but that is not really "risk/reward" just reward for easier approach for good placement.



I think you're right, in a way. I don't think it is risk/reward for most of the players out there. I think it is risk/reward for the guys that can throw over 400.
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Re: Course Upkeep 22 Aug 09

Postby Jay » Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:23 am

Big Thanks to Steve Nelson A.K.A. The Animal…. for clearing the trees on the right side of 15’s fairway as well as clearing the right hillside (next to soccer field). Awesome course maintenance!!!!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Shoe » Wed Jul 22, 2009 10:40 am

Thanks Steve :!:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Mon Aug 17, 2009 12:04 pm

A tree fell down across nine, right in front of the pad, just like the one earlier this year. It is gigantic. It's going to take some work to clean it up.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Aug 17, 2009 2:26 pm

Last time it was huge branch, I guess the tree fell this time. Thanks for the info, we will have to schedule a clean up one day after work.......
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby maximus » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:08 pm

I need some more firewood, I'll go by tomorrow and take a look at it and see what I can do with it.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Mon Aug 17, 2009 4:27 pm

Thanks Chris!

I have 3 people interested in helping out with the down tree. Anyone else that wants to help can bring gloves, chainsaw, or just a strong back tomorrow after work around 5:15ish.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:15 am

Big thanks to Don, Tyler, and Tim for getting a jump on the widow maker yesterday after work! After 2 hours of labor, they were able to at least see the other side of the fairway!

Also and big thanks to Steve (aka The Animal) for going out there this morning with the big chain saw to finish cutting the larger portions of the widow maker!!!!!

The only thing left now is to clean up the mess. We are planning to meet after work to move all that firewood off the fairway! Hopefully we can find a place for this stuff in case anyone needs some really good firewood!

Thanks guys!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby The Animal » Tue Aug 18, 2009 11:26 am

Also a big thanks to Chris who did some chainsaw work after I quit.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby maximus » Tue Aug 18, 2009 3:17 pm

I will be back out there at 5pm with saw in hand to finish with more people and some direction of where things need to go. I also sprayed TWO cans of wasp and hornet spray on the nest (or as close as I could get) and they seem to be dying, but I have one more can for us this afternoon!

Don't let the rain keep you away, come on out and help get this stuff moved!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:41 am

Big thanks to all that came out last night after work: Don, Chris F, Chris Q & his wife April, and BigHead. Also thanks to Steve N. for his morning work! That had to be the largest tree on the course and now we don't have shade over 9's tee pad anymore.

Wooded Disc Golf Courses can require alot of maintenance!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby daustin » Wed Sep 02, 2009 11:24 am

Boy, after reading through this thread it seems there are a lot of opinions out there about various holes on the course. HUmm, i think that the newest long pin on hole #6 is a par 3, figured on Pro ability playing it. Am ability maybe a par 3.5, but that dosen't compute does it? lol We are still tweaking that one some, although there are a couple of good alley's there is always room for improvement huh? :o) The back 6 holes could flow better, and we have put some thought into that over the past few years and may do some work in the valley next to 14 to add/change or replace a hole or 2 there. Our next pin installation will be another 18 pin, something a little shorter than the current pin - possibly over toward the park sign or toward where the old left pin was at one time. The back 6 holes were designed differently at the start, but the park changed some of it's layout for soccer fields..etc so our layout changed as well, not to mention the people who own Williams BBQ came over the property line when they bought that land and eliminated the old hole 17 which was a killer hole - thus leading to the curent hole 17. This course is evolving all the time, hopefully we'll make it more fun to play and more interesting/challenging as well. 'later guys!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby discraftrules » Wed Sep 02, 2009 4:06 pm

i think you should make all the holes shorter . besides hole # 7 i cant reach the cage on any of them and the launch pads are all facing the wrong way.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:08 am

discraftrules wrote:i think you should make all the holes shorter . besides hole # 7 i cant reach the cage on any of them and the launch pads are all facing the wrong way.


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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:35 am

Jay wrote:
discraftrules wrote:i think you should make all the holes shorter . besides hole # 7 i cant reach the cage on any of them and the launch pads are all facing the wrong way.


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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:38 am

...about the same 8)
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:40 am

Was Tim sending pm's to people, trying to mess with them? Was he telling people that he found their lost discs?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Thu Sep 03, 2009 11:57 am

I don't know, ask him.

87 people on this site have multiple screenames and get busted by many people. Let it go :)
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby mr.disc » Thu Sep 03, 2009 1:03 pm

:idea: :arrow: :oops:
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby bogeymaster » Thu Sep 03, 2009 9:16 pm

.
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby CorneliousVanderbildt » Fri Sep 04, 2009 12:05 am

Jay wrote: Let it go :)



says the guy who cried like a baby when I told chappy who was messing with him
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Jay » Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:37 am

no comment :?
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby Big Red » Fri Sep 04, 2009 9:52 am

daustin wrote:Boy, after reading through this thread it seems there are a lot of opinions out there about various holes on the course. HUmm, i think that the newest long pin on hole #6 is a par 3, figured on Pro ability playing it. Am ability maybe a par 3.5, but that dosen't compute does it? lol We are still tweaking that one some, although there are a couple of good alley's there is always room for improvement huh? :o) The back 6 holes could flow better, and we have put some thought into that over the past few years and may do some work in the valley next to 14 to add/change or replace a hole or 2 there. Our next pin installation will be another 18 pin, something a little shorter than the current pin - possibly over toward the park sign or toward where the old left pin was at one time. The back 6 holes were designed differently at the start, but the park changed some of it's layout for soccer fields..etc so our layout changed as well, not to mention the people who own Williams BBQ came over the property line when they bought that land and eliminated the old hole 17 which was a killer hole - thus leading to the curent hole 17. This course is evolving all the time, hopefully we'll make it more fun to play and more interesting/challenging as well. 'later guys!
Don


Old hole 17 was a killer hole? In what sense are you using the word "killer?"
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby djester » Fri Sep 04, 2009 1:00 pm

I always thought that old 17 was the best hole on the course.... then it got pulled and I haven't visited much after that..... catch me at cold snake classic though!!!
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Re: Course Upkeep

Postby daustin » Tue Sep 08, 2009 9:31 am

Big Red wrote:
daustin wrote:Boy, after reading through this thread it seems there are a lot of opinions out there about various holes on the course. HUmm, i think that the newest long pin on hole #6 is a par 3, figured on Pro ability playing it. Am ability maybe a par 3.5, but that dosen't compute does it? lol We are still tweaking that one some, although there are a couple of good alley's there is always room for improvement huh? :o) The back 6 holes could flow better, and we have put some thought into that over the past few years and may do some work in the valley next to 14 to add/change or replace a hole or 2 there. Our next pin installation will be another 18 pin, something a little shorter than the current pin - possibly over toward the park sign or toward where the old left pin was at one time. The back 6 holes were designed differently at the start, but the park changed some of it's layout for soccer fields..etc so our layout changed as well, not to mention the people who own Williams BBQ came over the property line when they bought that land and eliminated the old hole 17 which was a killer hole - thus leading to the curent hole 17. This course is evolving all the time, hopefully we'll make it more fun to play and more interesting/challenging as well. 'later guys!
Don


Old hole 17 was a killer hole? In what sense are you using the word "killer?"



As in lots of fun to play and scenic as well with the "A" to throw through at about 275'. :o) With the creek in front, hill to contend with and walkway to the right it punished errant throws as well.
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